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Post by francis on Apr 6, 2010 12:07:39 GMT 8
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Post by Kageyama on Apr 6, 2010 14:20:00 GMT 8
Horrible thing to happen. But it's really hard to put blame on the chopper pilots. They followed procedure and they saw weapons. Heck I saw a silhouette of an AK47 on the IR. And those cameras with long lenses do get mistaken for weapons, the guy peeking around the corner really looked like he had an RPG-7. Really if you watch the video with military protocol in mind and such it looks like a text book engagement. The van didn't get engaged until they were allowed to and I didn't even notice the kids all I was looking at was the people trying to take the body and any possible weapons and such.
It was a horrible event for sure, but regardless to how much procedure you have things are bound to go bad. I'm amazed though how quickly they'll show or try to show incidents like this yet the seem to never show how bad it can be on the side of the military.
Again though, it was a horrible incident that we all hope won't be repeated but things like that will happen and from the looks of it, the pilots weren't actively searching for unarmed people or civilians they could just shot indiscriminately. They were in area where insurgents were present and the area is still an active combat zone. Horrible but really it will happen, the video tries to pain the military in a bad light but I'm sure those pilots weren't happy with what they did when they found out. I doubt there was a party or high fives.
War is hell for everyone who is directly affected by it. And I really find it unfair how wikileaks (it's really a propaganda group) paints things and uses emotion to try to sway the user and not rhetoric. But heck just try to keep logic in mind when seeing anything like this. It was bad for it to have been supposedly covered up but try to really think about what you would have done in the pilots position.
Ignore the text and all those things put up there, just watch the video and think about what you would have done, first time you saw it did you notice the kids, overly lack of weapons, the "relaxed" manner of the people and such. I saw a group of individuals a few weapons and things that could have been mistaken for weapons and there movements were questionable, it was really an series of unfortunate events.
War is hell, we can just hope for the best and do what's right.
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Post by francis on Apr 6, 2010 17:36:45 GMT 8
This will be used as reference for many cases to come, that's for sure.
From an unbiased perspective:
The journalists just wanted to take a few shots and report on the action nearby. Unfortunately for them, an Apache crew overhead mistook them as insurgents and their equipment as weapons.
The Apache was called in to support ground forces who were taking small arms fire a few blocks nearby. The pilots reported seeing 'RPGs', in the radio intercepts, there was an armored column nearby and the 'RPG' was definitely a threat.
The journalists took a low profile and ended up looking like insurgents. They didnt even have Vests and helmets or any characteristics of journalists acting in an official capacity. It's also really not very smart running to a firefight just to take pictures.
On the US side, the lapses I think were on the commander's side where he gave permission to engage without asking the pilots AGAIN if they were absolutely positive they were carrying weapons. This could have refocused the pilots attention on the 'weapons'. Regarding the RPG, the camera lens didn't look like a shaped charge so they could have verified with another overhead pass.
What bothers me now is the use of 30mm shells against people.
those shells can rip armor apart and it's pretty nasty if you ask me.
Of course that's too late now. This is why we are seeing heavy restrictions on air attacks on Afghanistan like the operation in Marjah. The rules of engagement have been changed to prevent this exact kind of scenario. Innocent people, soldiers or insurgents getting killed are a reality of war. They die because they are at the wrong place at the wrong time.
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